Gas Gouging

[Hellion]

I bet alot of people in america are really pissed now

what kills me is oil is not much up above 100 dollars a barrel.

I sense some gouging is occurring IMO.

http://blog.mlive.com/annarbornews/2008/09...around_ann.html

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Supply and Demand

25% of the USA's Gasoline production is shut down.

[Msterbeau]

Glad I'm taking the train right now....

[SaGa]

when ike leaves it will go down. but you know it wont happen right away. there be money to make of the fact supply is down for a short burst.

opec is getting pissed that there money making price is going down. they announced decress of 500 thousand barrels a day. very small in world demand but still enough to change the price to some of there buyers

[Hellion]

http://www.wxyz.com/news/local/story.aspx?...107&rss=785

[Rev.Reverence]

I find it odd... that nobody EVER posted that gas was CHEAPER ($3.49) {I saw when scoring some cigs}

I would make some off statement as to the negative-nancyism..but...that wouldbe OVERTLY silly seeing as it IS a GOTH board...

[SaGa]

iv been seeing that to. a big fluxuation in gas prices between stations. speedway near me was at 3.89.... perhaps the large spike didnt hit that gas station yet. or the employees where to lazy to change the damn sign

pity i was hoping that the gas line go under 100 per barrel.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

It takes days to shut down a refinery. It still burning fuel the whole time. When the storm passes, it takes a few days to check for damage and repair any thats there. It takes at least 5 days to get the refinery up and running again.

It's dangerous as fuck too. Shut down is scary. I was in the refinery in Alma when they had to shut down do to an explosion and fire. It was the only time I ever saw my Dad do what he did best. He shut the unit down in 52 minutes. It was a record for not just that refinery, but for every refinery Total owned. He went up and down the whole 136 foot tall Crude Unit 5 times. Reading gauges manually and turning valves. Running in and out of the Control Room. The whole time yelling orders into his radio to other workers. I have never heard such a noise as what that machine was making. Steel can scream.

Errr... I digress.

[Fin]

We help own this responsibility, & a case can be made for this being the lack of foresight by automakers.

Fossil fuel has always been finite & costs have been projected to go upwards for decades. Perhaps this will wake up U.S. car companies & force them to deliver alternative fuel cars as they should have done over 20 years ago. As much as I am pro-American & pro-Detroit, I am royall pissed off with the U.S. "big 3" because they have been digging their own graves by continuing to sell huge gas-guzzling SUV's instead of looking into hybrid, electric, diesel, ethanol, & hydrogen alternatives WAY before now.

[SaGa]

We help own this responsibility, & a case can be made for this being the lack of foresight by automakers.

Fossil fuel has always been finite & costs have been projected to go upwards for decades. Perhaps this will wake up U.S. car companies & force them to deliver alternative fuel cars as they should have done over 20 years ago. As much as I am pro-American & pro-Detroit, I am royall pissed off with the U.S. "big 3" because they have been digging their own graves by continuing to sell huge gas-guzzling SUV's instead of looking into hybrid, electric, diesel, ethanol, & hydrogen alternatives WAY before now.

it was the amaricans who purchased those SUVS. car companies will only reserch something if there is demand for it. or they see a possible demand in the future. why should they retool a slew of shops for hybrids when 3 ton suvs where selling like hot cakes. the price tag and sacrifice for doing that whould be a huge investment in itself for something at the time didnt know whould even sell well enough to merit it. .

what your implying is the car companies dictate what consumers will buy, and its not the consumer who dictates what the car companies are going to sell the most of.

the good thing is talks of flint getting back in the game of manufacturing with chevy volt.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Ford has a car that gets 60mpg but is only going to sell it in Europe. it's a Diesel and they don't think it will sell well here. I just read about it the other day.

[SaGa]

Ford has a car that gets 60mpg but is only going to sell it in Europe. it's a Diesel and they don't think it will sell well here. I just read about it the other day.

ill have to admit the one bitch i have is europe gets cars amaricans cant get without paying up the ass. are they being made in the us?

[Fin]

it was the amaricans who purchased those SUVS. car companies will only reserch something if there is demand for it. or they see a possible demand in the future. why should they retool a slew of shops for hybrids when 3 ton suvs where selling like hot cakes. the price tag and sacrifice for doing that whould be a huge investment in itself for something at the time didnt know whould even sell well enough to merit it. .

what your implying is the car companies dictate what consumers will buy, and its not the consumer who dictates what the car companies are going to sell the most of.

the good thing is talks of flint getting back in the game of manufacturing with chevy volt.

No doubt it is a vicious circle, but the auto companies must lead the way, IMO. They have waited far too long, continually using the excuse that they just make what consumers demand. That's balderdash--SUV's were never required to average 12 MPG, that's just how they were manufactured in order to turn a quick profit. The writing has been on the wall for a long time, & everyone is now trying to pass the buck. With all due respect for the big 3, f*ck 'em. They should have been working on this--& seriously--for the past twenty years.

[Msterbeau]

No doubt it is a vicious circle, but the auto companies must lead the way, IMO. They have waited far too long, continually using the excuse that they just make what consumers demand. That's balderdash--SUV's were never required to average 12 MPG, that's just how they were manufactured in order to turn a quick profit. The writing has been on the wall for a long time, & everyone is now trying to pass the buck. With all due respect for the big 3, f*ck 'em. They should have been working on this--& seriously--for the past twenty years.

Everyone involved deserves some blame for where we are now. Short-sighted people have continued to ignore the reality of oil as a finite resource. Spineless politicians refused to enact legislation, or tax gas in such a way that consumers would have no choice but to rethink transportation and gasoline use priorities. And the manufacturers pretended like they had no power to influence the market at all nor try to optimize products people did want for better fuel efficiency. many Americans think "freedom" means freedom to waste and abuse the earths resources, just because they can. They all need to be clubbed over the head with a dose of reality.

[sass_in_the_pants]

grrr...I could have filled up THE VAN last night.

The van! Ugh!

I'm glad Guy is carpooling tio work now (and I'm only ten miles away from work)

Still! Sucky.

[pomba gira]

No doubt it is a vicious circle, but the auto companies must lead the way, IMO. They have waited far too long, continually using the excuse that they just make what consumers demand. That's balderdash--SUV's were never required to average 12 MPG, that's just how they were manufactured in order to turn a quick profit. The writing has been on the wall for a long time, & everyone is now trying to pass the buck. With all due respect for the big 3, f*ck 'em. They should have been working on this--& seriously--for the past twenty years.

I have to agree. There are plenty of people who would have purchased hybrids or whatever 10 years ago, but couldn't afford the prices being charged for them. And those Mini Coopers sell like hotcakes here, and I bet they're even more popular in places where parking is a major issue. No reason the Big 3 couldn't have offered some stylish, WELL-MADE little commuter cars, instead of Yugo-esque throwaways that scream "I couldn't afford anything better".

Of course there's plenty of blame to go around- there is really no reason other than ostentation to buy, say, an Expedition instead of an Explorer since the former doesn't really hold any more passengers or cargo than the latter. But as a rule the average person is going to buy what's available and presented as desirable.

The really sucky thing is that the people affected the most by all this aren't the ones driving around in Navigators and H2s... it's my student's parents, who make less in a day than it costs to fill the gas tank now. For these people the price of gas doesn't mean they have to cut back on "luxuries"... it means they have to choose between gas and things like clothing, medicine, and food.

[sass_in_the_pants]

The really sucky thing is that the people affected the most by all this aren't the ones driving around in Navigators and H2s... it's my student's parents, who make less in a day than it costs to fill the gas tank now. For these people the price of gas doesn't mean they have to cut back on "luxuries"... it means they have to choose between gas and things like clothing, medicine, and food.

That's just it - if you make $10 an hour, so let's say $80 a day, but you spend $10-$20 of that each day to get to your work, all of a sudden, your job no longer cuts it.

I tell Guy all the time - yeah, we have to cut back on other stuff to afford gas prices, but we HAVE other stuff to cut back on - not everybody does.

The good news in all of this though, is since the last time gas hit $4 a gallon bus ridership and carpooling went up - and for the most part, stayed up.

We might be seeing a real shift in thinking as to what is necessary and important. And it might be a shift that people actually LIKE.

I've talked to friend who have started taking the bus to work and they all say that even if gas prices go down, they'll keep riding the bus - they actually like it!

And Guy, Mr. I Like To Drive Alone, really likes to carpool now. So, I keep praying that this short-term crunch will yield long-term benefits to our culture.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

ill have to admit the one bitch i have is europe gets cars amaricans cant get without paying up the ass. are they being made in the us?

Not sure, but I dont think so.

[Destroit]

We help own this responsibility, & a case can be made for this being the lack of foresight by automakers.

Fossil fuel has always been finite & costs have been projected to go upwards for decades. Perhaps this will wake up U.S. car companies & force them to deliver alternative fuel cars as they should have done over 20 years ago. As much as I am pro-American & pro-Detroit, I am royall pissed off with the U.S. "big 3" because they have been digging their own graves by continuing to sell huge gas-guzzling SUV's instead of looking into hybrid, electric, diesel, ethanol, & hydrogen alternatives WAY before now.

+1

[Hellion]

Detroit needs mass transit big time,vehicles are the worst investment ever.unless its a classic car.