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What exactly is wrong with being conservative?


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I'm honestly curious on why a large majority of people on here think that leaning to the right or being conservative is such a horrible thing. I mean is it so wrong to have traditional values, believing in a limited government, and believe in God? Because I've gotten the vibe from many people here, that being conservative is wrong and being liberal is the only way to go.

So please explain to me why you think that way so I can understand your point of view.

Ok, first of all, Tits, if you were here, I'd totally kick your ass (metaphorically) and it would have nothing to do with politics :wink

Secondly, there IS nothing wrong, per se, with having traditional values, believing in a limited government, and believing in G-d.

Just as there's nothing wrong with having progressive values,

believing in a comprehensive government that looks out for its most vulnerable citizens,

and not believing in a higher power.

(Except in the case of Hebrew National hot dogs. Those ARE created by divine intervention and there is no further discussion on the matter)

They are just different worldviews and philosophies.

(In case you were wondering, mine is right one :happy: )

In fact, your question is a tad flawed to begin with.

The large majority on here is NOT liberal.

Or conservative.

There IS NO majority viewpoint

There are nothing but minority viewpoints on here even when broken down to overly simplistic groupings.

The highest % of political viewpoints (though far less than 50%) seem to be of a -----pure Libertarian nature

(Small govt, maximum indiv freedom, liberalized social mores aka civil libertarianism)

After that,

---I'd say liberal/leftist.

Third most, we have the centrists. They come on and post, and you never know which side they're going to fall on.

Oftentimes their views play out like the crowd in Julius Caesar, changing whenever a persuasive argument comes along

"Hail eternal!"

(3 posts later)

"Hail Gaf!" Those people frustrate me the most.

But this being a goth board, I need to acknowledge the ACTUAL majority viewpoint.

Most people on here are so nihilistic THAT

the vast majority of people look at this whole

Political forum and think

"We should just blow this ENTIRE section off the board,

Then so we could watch all the dumb right and left wing whiners complain about how no ones paying attention to their viewpoint---Angry idiots."

"Oh fuck it, I'm outta here. I need to go on Facebook and whine about something far more important than this shit---ME"

BUT I DIGRESS---

The reason why you see unfortunate manners and viewpoints from liberals from time to time has NOTHING to do with the message, but the message bearers of the conservative mantra.

Let's look at the heavy-hitters

Glenn Beck, the most recognizable standard bearer of the conservative movement today, taking the torch as of late from Rush Limbaugh

Beck is a very shrewd intelligent man.

Very few could do what he does.

And what does he do?

He gets paid multi-multi millions to play on people's emotions, as opposed to their rationality,

and whip them all up in a frenzy about doomsday coming tomorrow.

He uses hyperbole and Nazi comparisons-galore that have little or no basis in reality.

He fear-mongers daily as if every action a Democrat takes will be our last.

In Beck's world, it will only be a matter of minutes, no seconds before Obama and Pelosi enslave us forever in a Communist nightmare that we will never awake from.

I'm sorry but that's a crock of shit.

AT THE SAME TIME, it would ALSO have been a crock of shit to have said the same of George W Bush when he was president.

I have to admit, when Obama stood up a month or so back and finally said, Fuck y'all, we're ramming this health care bill down your throats, George W Bush-style,

I finally appreciated the bull-headedness of our previous President.

W wasn't trying to destroy America.

He was simply doing what he thought was best for her.

And when he didn't get cooperation, to quote Palin, he "went rogue"

And guess what, after eight years of what I thought was the worst policy decisions I'll see in my lifetime, we're still here!

ALL of us!

No matter what bone-headed anarchist or liberal said the end is near,

We all still live and breathe!

Almost none of the liberals moved to Canada,

MI is the same economic shit-hole it was when Bush took office,

and we all have relatively the same standing as we did before.

So Tits, the same thing you got a little frustrated with Slogo for pointing out at the beginning of this thread, is in actuality the thing that causes the most ire among people of different views.

It's not the philosophy, which any good contrarian would RESPECTFULLY disagree with.

It's when you put on the radio or TV---your Glenn Becks or your Rush Limbaughs,

who let's face it are entertainers--not pundits--(They got their career starts as shock jocks after all)

it's hard NOT to get all defensive and condescending.

BUT THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PHILOSOPHY.

AS FOR OUR LEADERS IN CONGRESS-----

Politics has gotten so, well, political, so they're no longer arguing beliefs and philosophies, they're just justifying the stupid shit their guys are doing

all the while trying to claim that the stupid shit the other guys are doing is going to bring about a worldwide meltdown any second.

When in the end, all they're doing is arguing about stupid shit.

And the good stuff that may be emerging, from a senator here or a representative there,

is universally ignored,

because g-d forbid we acknowledge a good idea,

especially if it comes from a guy that doesn't belong to the same party as our own.

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Except people appluad it when it was done to Bush and then turn around and say how wrong it is to do to Obama.

Several reasons actually imo.

1.) People are hypocrites... plain and simple... both (major) parties act like bickering children and then point the finger when the other party is behaving the same way that they were only a few years ago.

2.) If by "people" you mean "DGN people" then it is because the board leads more liberal because of the type of subculture... most people here are NOT against gay marriage, women's choice, teaching evolution, medical marijuana, censorship, racial profiling, religious freedom, etc... which is what the current conservative/republican/right wing seems to stand for (at least those who are making the most noise in the media: Palin, Limbaugh, Beck, etc...) There are other conservative concepts that this board is more 50/50 on like taxation, healthcare, disaster management, etc... but I believe the more "noisy" conservative concepts as listed above tip the scales in the left direction on DGN.

3.) If you mean "people" as in "everyone" or "America" in general applaud when it is done to Bush and not Obama... It is perhaps because the media is actually more liberal (which I have not seen too much evidence of.. but I could be wrong) OR (and I know this is a shock) but perhaps Bush was actually a much worse president than Obama is (at least right now... Obama could get worse)... and people honestly think that Bush deserves a higher amount of ridicule at this point in time... even if Obama is not as popular as he was.

(those are my thoughts)

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Several reasons actually imo.

1.) People are hypocrites... plain and simple... both (major) parties act like bickering children and then point the finger when the other party is behaving the same way that they were only a few years ago.

2.) If by "people" you mean "DGN people" then it is because the board leads more liberal because of the type of subculture... most people here are NOT against gay marriage, women's choice, teaching evolution, medical marijuana, censorship, racial profiling, religious freedom, etc... which is what the current conservative/republican/right wing seems to stand for (at least those who are making the most noise in the media: Palin, Limbaugh, Beck, etc...) There are other conservative concepts that this board is more 50/50 on like taxation, healthcare, disaster management, etc... but I believe the more "noisy" conservative concepts as listed above tip the scales in the left direction on DGN.

3.) If you mean "people" as in "everyone" or "America" in general applaud when it is done to Bush and not Obama... It is perhaps because the media is actually more liberal (which I have not seen too much evidence of.. but I could be wrong) OR (and I know this is a shock) but perhaps Bush was actually a much worse president than Obama is (at least right now... Obama could get worse)... and people honestly think that Bush deserves a higher amount of ridicule at this point in time... even if Obama is not as popular as he was.

(those are my thoughts)

1. I agree with you on this one.

2. though not what I meant.. I do have to address a small point. Conservative ideals line up more with the Goth/Punk subculture than Lieberal ideals do. Thats why a very large portion of the bands we all cherish are made up of conservatives. Granted, in the last 5-10 years many of the makers of our music express Liberal/Socialist ideals... but when you ask them what they actually want.. they express Conservative ideals. I always find that rather funny. BTW, the whole concept of "What I do in my bed room is none of your business." is NOT a Liberal idea, it's a conservative idea. People tend to confuse what the "church" has done with Conservative thought.

3. This is the line of thought I was in. I would disagree with you on Obama doing a better job... see our unemployment rate, earnings figures that came out last week and his Oil leak response as proof. BTW... Did Obama know about the catastrophic floods in Tennessee and surrounding states or does he just hate white people? Oh wait, he did approve funding for releif... but only to Union Members...

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1. I agree with you on this one.

2. though not what I meant.. I do have to address a small point. Conservative ideals line up more with the Goth/Punk subculture than Lieberal ideals do. Thats why a very large portion of the bands we all cherish are made up of conservatives. Granted, in the last 5-10 years many of the makers of our music express Liberal/Socialist ideals... but when you ask them what they actually want.. they express Conservative ideals. I always find that rather funny. BTW, the whole concept of "What I do in my bed room is none of your business." is NOT a Liberal idea, it's a conservative idea. People tend to confuse what the "church" has done with Conservative thought.

3. This is the line of thought I was in. I would disagree with you on Obama doing a better job... see our unemployment rate, earnings figures that came out last week and his Oil leak response as proof. BTW... Did Obama know about the catastrophic floods in Tennessee and surrounding states or does he just hate white people? Oh wait, he did approve funding for releif... but only to Union Members...

And the fact he's skipping laying the wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldiers at Arlington on Monday. He doesn't seem to care about the military.

Edited by TitsMcGee
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1. I agree with you on this one.

2. though not what I meant.. I do have to address a small point. Conservative ideals line up more with the Goth/Punk subculture than Lieberal ideals do. Thats why a very large portion of the bands we all cherish are made up of conservatives. Granted, in the last 5-10 years many of the makers of our music express Liberal/Socialist ideals... but when you ask them what they actually want.. they express Conservative ideals. I always find that rather funny. BTW, the whole concept of "What I do in my bed room is none of your business." is NOT a Liberal idea, it's a conservative idea. People tend to confuse what the "church" has done with Conservative thought.

3. This is the line of thought I was in. I would disagree with you on Obama doing a better job... see our unemployment rate, earnings figures that came out last week and his Oil leak response as proof. BTW... Did Obama know about the catastrophic floods in Tennessee and surrounding states or does he just hate white people? Oh wait, he did approve funding for releif... but only to Union Members...

Yeah about number 2... thats why I wanted to word it the way that I did "which is what the current conservative/republican/right wing seems to stand for (at least those who are making the most noise in the media: Palin, Limbaugh, Beck, etc...)" As far as the goth punk subculture lining up with conservative ideals... I guess I have never seen that, Some of the larger Goth/industrial players of the genre most clearly did not line up with the ideals, namely Skinny Puppy, Ministry, NIN, KMFDM... All very much and publicly: Skinny Puppy's album THE GREATER WRONG OF THE RIGHT, and Pretty much every Ministry album while a Bush has been in office. I am curious, since your viewpoints usually have a background in some rational area, which industrial/gothic/punk bands and evidence have you seen that actually have agreed with conservative ideals? (At least within the last 20 years or so...)

And as far as number 3, I am not saying Obama IS doing a better job, I am saying that the comparisons that are being made about Bush vs Obama and people applauding the tacky Bush bashing stuff vs applauding the Obama bashing stuff is because this is what people think right now. It has been clear that no matter what happens you will never change your opinion about Obama, and I am not trying to argue his merits here as it is useless to do so... But what I am arguing is that people PERCEIVE he is doing ... not a good job, but a better job then Bush did... Almost every mistake that Obama has made so far has had people/news stating that this is "Obama's <PICK A BUSH FUCK UP>" The oil spill = OBAMA'S KATRINA, AFGHANISTAN = OBAMA'S IRAQ, there have been comparisons almost everywhere some of the Banking stuff is being called OBAMA'S ENRON for example... Even by the networks that were on Bush's shaft the entire time in office are making these comparisons. Tells me that for every mistake that Obama has made, there was already a Bush fuck up to be compared to... Which to me clearly shows that they thought Bush was the lowest common denominator.

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And the fact he's skipping laying the wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldiers at Arlington on Monday. He doesn't seem to care about the military.

LOL at least he didn't send a bunch of people to needlessly die based on lies.... That to me is worse then not caring for the military... that shows just how much Bush did not care at all for human life in general.

I would choose not laying a wreath over sending soldiers into senseless slaughter 100% of the time.

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LOL at least he didn't send a bunch of people to needlessly die based on lies.... That to me is worse then not caring for the military... that shows just how much Bush did not care at all for human life in general.

I would choose not laying a wreath over sending soldiers into senseless slaughter 100% of the time.

For the President to not be at Arlington National Cemetery on fucking MEMORIAL DAY is a slap in the face to anyone who has served, and the families who lost their loved ones. At this point it doesn't matter what Bush did or didn't do, it's Obama's job now.

Edit to add:

He's not laying the wreath because he's going on "vacation" to Chicago. He has his own freaking plane, I think he could make it back to lay the wreath.

Edited by TitsMcGee
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For the President to not be at Arlington National Cemetery on fucking MEMORIAL DAY is a slap in the face to anyone who has served, and the families who lost their loved ones. At this point it doesn't matter what Bush did or didn't do, it's Obama's job now.

Edit to add:

He's not laying the wreath because he's going on "vacation" to Chicago. He has his own freaking plane, I think he could make it back to lay the wreath.

This is true... again... I am not saying that Obama is GOOD... only that he is not AS BAD.

Both are kind of f-ups in their own way... Bush Killed thousands of Americans for no reason, and Obama did not lay a wreath.

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This is true... again... I am not saying that Obama is GOOD... only that he is not AS BAD.

Both are kind of f-ups in their own way... Bush Killed thousands of Americans for no reason, and Obama did not lay a wreath.

Those thousands of American's joined the military of their own free will, and the majority of them believe in the job they are doing. What Obama is doing by not being at Arlington on Monday, is that he doesn't care about the sacrifice they made. What message does that send to all our men and women serving, when their Commander and Chief doesn't care about those who were lost enough to lay a freaking wreath and have a few pictures taken? It kinda kills the moral.

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>>>The original point I was addressing was about how both groups portray politicians in equally distasteful ways... but Gaf mentioned that the ones who did it when Bush was in office were applauded, and the Obama ones not so much.... and this is potentially a reason why

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Those thousands of American's joined the military of their own free will, and the majority of them believe in the job they are doing. What Obama is doing by not being at Arlington on Monday, is that he doesn't care about the sacrifice they made. What message does that send to all our men and women serving, when their Commander and Chief doesn't care about those who were lost enough to lay a freaking wreath and have a few pictures taken? It kinda kills the moral.

This is true... very not good....

I guess if I had to choose between the killing of moral... and the needless slaughter of thousands of Americans... I would choose the lesser of two evils...

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